Laowa 58mm f/2.8 2X Ultra-Macro APO

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chris_ma
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Laowa 58mm f/2.8 2X Ultra-Macro APO

Post by chris_ma »

Venus Optics seems to be at a roll - they released another Laowa lens, the Laowa 58mm f/2.8 2X Ultra-Macro APO.

it covers full frame and is available in all FF mirrorless mounts.
it lists at 500USD
https://www.venuslens.net/product/5828- ... -macro-apo

the MTF is slightly lower then the 100mm, but looks still great.
chris

ray_parkhurst
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Re: Laowa 58mm f/2.8 2X Ultra-Macro APO

Post by ray_parkhurst »

They make this claim:

"The 58mm would give a greater depth of field relative to other longer focal length lenses. You can get more in-focus area of your subject under the same aperture. This gives you more control when creating unique visual narratives."

Why do they say this?

enricosavazzi
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Re: Laowa 58mm f/2.8 2X Ultra-Macro APO

Post by enricosavazzi »

ray_parkhurst wrote:
Sat Sep 24, 2022 6:24 am
They make this claim:

"The 58mm would give a greater depth of field relative to other longer focal length lenses. You can get more in-focus area of your subject under the same aperture. This gives you more control when creating unique visual narratives."

Why do they say this?
Short of this lens having a pupil ratio unusually different from unity, I know of no reason why this could be true (and even in case of an unusual pupil ratio, it still would not be true if the effective aperture is considered in the comparison, rather than the nominal aperture). Higher DOF (if true) also implies a higher diffraction, which is a consequence that the tech writers prefer not to mention, but unavoidable nonetheless.

An asymmetric pupil ratio is commonly used in macro lenses for the opposite goal, i.e. providing a lower effective f/ratio aperture (compared to a lens with unity pupil ratio). Indeed a macro lens could be designed with a pupil ratio that provides a higher effective f/ratio, but this can easily be achieved just by stopping down more.

I would tend to chalk this statement up to a lack of communication between the optical design team and the technical writers who wrote the promotion materials. This type of disconnect seems to be the most frequent source of wrong or questionable statements in lens promotion materials.
--ES

RobertOToole
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Re: Laowa 58mm f/2.8 2X Ultra-Macro APO

Post by RobertOToole »

chris_ma wrote:
Sat Sep 24, 2022 1:53 am
Venus Optics seems to be at a roll - they released another Laowa lens, the Laowa 58mm f/2.8 2X Ultra-Macro APO.

it covers full frame and is available in all FF mirrorless mounts.
it lists at 500USD
https://www.venuslens.net/product/5828- ... -macro-apo

the MTF is slightly lower then the 100mm, but looks still great.
I find the fact that Laowa is offering 9 different macro lenses in various mounts even more interesting! They deserve some kind of a medal or award for that!

58MM F/2.8 2X ULTRA-MACRO APO
90MM F/2.8 2X ULTRA MACRO APO
85MM F/5.6 2X ULTRA MACRO APO
50MM F/2.8 2X ULTRA MACRO APO
60MM F/2.8 2X ULTRA-MACRO
65MM F/2.8 2X ULTRA-MACRO APO
100MM F/2.8 2X ULTRA MACRO APO
24MM F/14 2X MACRO PROBE
25MM F/2.8 2.5-5X ULTRA MACRO

For me the most interesting one?

85MM F/5.6 2X ULTRA MACRO APO!

That thing is tiny! They should call it a Mini-macro.

Laowa-85.jpg

 

ray_parkhurst
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Re: Laowa 58mm f/2.8 2X Ultra-Macro APO

Post by ray_parkhurst »

RobertOToole wrote:
Thu Oct 06, 2022 10:13 am
For me the most interesting one?

85MM F/5.6 2X ULTRA MACRO APO!

That thing is tiny! They should call it a Mini-macro.
 
Is it aperture-limited, or do you need to stop it down further? If it's super sharp wide open, then indeed it might be a super lens, though EA18 at 2x is going to be fairly limiting.

Edited to add: only Laowa lens I own is the original 60/2.8 2x. It's a wonderful lens, and renders like an old Zeiss, with great depth. Most of my best walkaround macro pics have been taken with it.

RobertOToole
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Re: Laowa 58mm f/2.8 2X Ultra-Macro APO

Post by RobertOToole »

ray_parkhurst wrote:
Thu Oct 06, 2022 10:18 am
RobertOToole wrote:
Thu Oct 06, 2022 10:13 am
For me the most interesting one?

85MM F/5.6 2X ULTRA MACRO APO!

That thing is tiny! They should call it a Mini-macro.
Hi Ray,
 

Is it aperture-limited, or do you need to stop it down further?
Laowa shows MTF data at f/5.6. Looks pretty decent. Better be at that slow aperture.
If it's super sharp wide open, then indeed it might be a super lens, though EA18 at 2x is going to be fairly limiting.
I don't remember ever shooting 2x in the field, I tend to shoot at more intermediate ratios like like 1:3 - 1:2 maybe. I don't even shoot 1x very often, maybe thats just me. I am just thinking the light weight in-the-field can make it easy to stay out a few more hours before you need to take a break. 180 f/2.8 lenses are not the most user friendly lens after hand-holding few hours when its hot.
Edited to add: only Laowa lens I own is the original 60/2.8 2x. It's a wonderful lens, and renders like an old Zeiss, with great depth. Most of my best walkaround macro pics have been taken with it.
Yes right that is the model that was private labeled by some other lens resellers. Not bad for the price but the unit I had, an Oshiro version, some de-centered elements.

Best,

Robert

chris_ma
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Re: Laowa 58mm f/2.8 2X Ultra-Macro APO

Post by chris_ma »

RobertOToole wrote:
Thu Oct 06, 2022 10:13 am
I find the fact that Laowa is offering 9 different macro lenses in various mounts even more interesting! They deserve some kind of a medal or award for that!
agreed - and they just released a cinevised version for of the 60mm APS and the 100mm FF for an incredible price
https://www.newsshooter.com/2022/10/06/ ... o-cine-ff/
chris

RobertOToole
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Re: Laowa 58mm f/2.8 2X Ultra-Macro APO

Post by RobertOToole »

chris_ma wrote:
Thu Oct 06, 2022 12:27 pm
RobertOToole wrote:
Thu Oct 06, 2022 10:13 am
I find the fact that Laowa is offering 9 different macro lenses in various mounts even more interesting! They deserve some kind of a medal or award for that!
agreed - and they just released a cinevised version for of the 60mm APS and the 100mm FF for an incredible price
https://www.newsshooter.com/2022/10/06/ ... o-cine-ff/
Smart marketing department!

Best,

Robert

enricosavazzi
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Re: Laowa 58mm f/2.8 2X Ultra-Macro APO

Post by enricosavazzi »

RobertOToole wrote:
Thu Oct 06, 2022 10:13 am
I find the fact that Laowa is offering 9 different macro lenses in various mounts even more interesting! They deserve some kind of a medal or award for that!

58MM F/2.8 2X ULTRA-MACRO APO
90MM F/2.8 2X ULTRA MACRO APO
85MM F/5.6 2X ULTRA MACRO APO
50MM F/2.8 2X ULTRA MACRO APO
60MM F/2.8 2X ULTRA-MACRO
65MM F/2.8 2X ULTRA-MACRO APO
100MM F/2.8 2X ULTRA MACRO APO
24MM F/14 2X MACRO PROBE
25MM F/2.8 2.5-5X ULTRA MACRO

For me the most interesting one?

85MM F/5.6 2X ULTRA MACRO APO!
I had in fact been considering the 85 mm, but that was before OM System announced their 90 mm f/3.5 2x for Micro 4/3. Now I am waiting for the latter. Contrary to what some of the other macro photographers maintain, in my experience AF can become very handy in certain situations, even in macro. Rapidly moving, highly painful stinging insects like the tarantula hawk wasp (Pepsis formosa) in New Mexico are an example I like to make ( http://www.photomacrography.net/forum/v ... wk#p131150 ). I had no problem with the Olympus 60 mm macro in AF mode at about 0.5x, but I doubt I would have been able to take home any good images with a manual-focus lens.
If anyone is interested, on my web site I have tests of the following Laowa macro lenses:
100 mm f/2.8 Ultra Macro Apo: https://www.savazzi.net/photography/laowa-100-2-8.html (also contains tests of the Sony 90 mm f/2.8 macro, which I found quite disappointing)
25 mm f/2.8 2.5-5x: https://www.savazzi.net/photography/laowa-25-2-8.html
I also have the Laowa 60 mm f/2.8 2x (the original, non-Apo one), but did not think much of it (especially on FF, which it is not really designed for). It is cheaper than other Laowa macro lenses, but clearly not in the same class. I would not be surprised if it will be the first model to be discontinued by Laowa: https://savazzi.net/photography/laowa-oshiro-test.html and https://www.savazzi.net/photography/60mm-2x-lenses.html
Last edited by enricosavazzi on Fri Oct 07, 2022 7:24 am, edited 1 time in total.
--ES

MarkSturtevant
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Re: Laowa 58mm f/2.8 2X Ultra-Macro APO

Post by MarkSturtevant »

RobertOToole wrote:
Thu Oct 06, 2022 10:13 am

58MM F/2.8 2X ULTRA-MACRO APO
90MM F/2.8 2X ULTRA MACRO APO
85MM F/5.6 2X ULTRA MACRO APO
50MM F/2.8 2X ULTRA MACRO APO
60MM F/2.8 2X ULTRA-MACRO
65MM F/2.8 2X ULTRA-MACRO APO
100MM F/2.8 2X ULTRA MACRO APO
24MM F/14 2X MACRO PROBE
25MM F/2.8 2.5-5X ULTRA MACRO
Let's not forget this specialty lens:
15mm F/4 WIDE ANGLE MACRO LENS.

I have their 25mm 2.5-5X lens and I absolutely love it. But I'm not sure why they are coming out with so many variations of macro lenses. Surely that will only thin out the sales for individual 2X lenses, leading to discontinuation of some of them down the line.
Mark Sturtevant
Dept. of Still Waters

dickb
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Re: Laowa 58mm f/2.8 2X Ultra-Macro APO

Post by dickb »

MarkSturtevant wrote:
Fri Oct 07, 2022 6:36 am
RobertOToole wrote:
Thu Oct 06, 2022 10:13 am

58MM F/2.8 2X ULTRA-MACRO APO
90MM F/2.8 2X ULTRA MACRO APO
85MM F/5.6 2X ULTRA MACRO APO
50MM F/2.8 2X ULTRA MACRO APO
60MM F/2.8 2X ULTRA-MACRO
65MM F/2.8 2X ULTRA-MACRO APO
100MM F/2.8 2X ULTRA MACRO APO
24MM F/14 2X MACRO PROBE
25MM F/2.8 2.5-5X ULTRA MACRO
Let's not forget this specialty lens:
15mm F/4 WIDE ANGLE MACRO LENS.

I have their 25mm 2.5-5X lens and I absolutely love it. But I'm not sure why they are coming out with so many variations of macro lenses. Surely that will only thin out the sales for individual 2X lenses, leading to discontinuation of some of them down the line.
They do try to target different camera system users with the many different lenses:

58MM F/2.8 2X ULTRA-MACRO APO mirrorless full frame
90MM F/2.8 2X ULTRA MACRO APO mirrorless full frame
85MM F/5.6 2X ULTRA MACRO APO mirrorless full frame compact
50MM F/2.8 2X ULTRA MACRO APO micro 43
60MM F/2.8 2X ULTRA-MACRO dslr APS-C
65MM F/2.8 2X ULTRA-MACRO APO mirrorless APS-C
100MM F/2.8 2X ULTRA MACRO APO dslr full frame

Still a lot of options, I agree.

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