V-slot frame for macro rig (COMPLETED).

Yawns · Post by **Yawns** » Tue Jul 02, 2019 9:48 am

Note: I'm doing this just for hobby and out of curiosity ... I've never seen / used V-Slot and I'm curious. If it does not works as expected .. tough tatties

...

The idea is to make a station very compact and with all the components organized. (Wemacro controler, smartphone, monitor ...) and hidden cables (if possible).
Portable, easily transportable by the house, easy to put in the trunk of the car, all at once withou need to mount / dismount whatever. Easy to take to a gathering, vacation, or to the field with batteries)
The base area is not much bigger than 2 european office sheets 2xA4.

The design is simple but it was not easy to establish measurements and design. Many changes in measurements and design to keep it compact. The parts must have space to work, with different working distances flash positions etc ...
I also was very conditioned because I need to use the parts I already have.. like the weights for the base. (later it can be replaced with a stone slab easy.
I hope it can be tilted and run vertically too .. but I'll only know after have it done....

It was also not easy to keep costs under control. (and it got more expensive than expected)

The V-Slot is very misleading.
The components seem cheap ... 1 to 3 euros ... the bar is also cheap .. 2 to 5 euros per 50cm ...

but when you begin to realize that you need 4x of this, 8x of that, 20x of that other, 140 bolts, 140 nuts, etc... etc.. The price goes up

200 euros Total .. Ouch ... Ouch .. Ouch ....

I could make some cuts but it's nonsense to end up with something that is not what I want only to save 20-30 euros.

Better buy the Wemacro stand .. except it is not so fun.

Just placed the order for the components at
www.Ratrig.com

I hope I can post a photo of this mounted in 2 weeks ...

Screenshot 2019-06-30 at 06.30.31 by antonio caseiro, no Flickr

Screenshot 2019-06-30 at 06.29.57 by antonio caseiro, no Flickr

Screenshot 2019-06-30 at 06.44.23 by antonio caseiro, no Flickr

Sem título by antonio caseiro, no Flickr

Screenshot 2019-06-29 at 19.03.20 by antonio caseiro, no Flickr

Screenshot 2019-06-29 at 19.04.36 by antonio caseiro, no Flickr

Screenshot 2019-06-29 at 19.05.16 by antonio caseiro, no Flickr

dickb · Post by **dickb** » Wed Jul 03, 2019 11:36 am

So if I see this correctly the vslot is just the frame, you don't use it for any moving parts, right? So any extrusion might do, the vslot was just the convenient version for you, correct?

Yawns · Post by **Yawns** » Wed Jul 03, 2019 1:41 pm

dickb wrote:So if I see this correctly the vslot is just the frame, you don't use it for any moving parts, right? So any extrusion might do, the vslot was just the convenient version for you, correct?

Yes any extrusion might do... I am using V-slot (20 x 20 mm) for the frame and 20x60 for the main beam, but I also considered to use T-slot (30x30)
V-slot came out more convenient because I there's a local company who sells the V-slot beams and all the accessories...

And yes it't just the frame.. all the rest is the Wemacro rail and some parts from SmallRig to hold the flashes ...

Screenshot 2019-06-23 at 00.06.10 by antonio caseiro, no Flickr

There is one moving part.. but I did not add it to the CAD design yet... on the right side there will be gantry cart with wheels, sliding along the main beam to hold the insect positioner ( a XYZ stage - not yet in the CAD design too) )

https://cdn11.bigcommerce.com/s-itwgldv ... mbypass=on

mawyatt · Post by **mawyatt** » Wed Jul 03, 2019 1:42 pm

Yawns,

Nice looking setup, will be interesting to see how it performs.

You might consider adding some rubber feet, maybe some properly loaded Sorbathane type. Feet not only help with external vibration, but also prevent scratching surfaces.

Best,

kaleun96 · Post by **kaleun96** » Wed Jul 03, 2019 2:12 pm

I like the concept and for 200 euro I think you've done well! My Newport 150x450 breadboard (well it's 300+150 breadboard) cost 130 euro or so alone.

I have the same gear from SmallRig too. I like their stuff, though some is stupidly expensive. I recently removed that adapter plate and modified the lens support part to attach to my bellows. The adapter plate was adding a bit too much height, didn't quite fit my hole patterns for other parts, and I thought the 15mm rods coming off it weren't good for vibration due to the leverage.

I've kept the rods and lens support but they're attached to a more sturdy part of my rig so they don't directly induce camera vibration as much. I bought another set of rods with two rod mounts (similar to what the lens support attaches to) and mount this vertically for my flash mount. Cheap and works well for giving me adjustable height.

Yawns · Post by **Yawns** » Wed Jul 03, 2019 4:13 pm

mawyatt wrote:Yawns,

Nice looking setup, will be interesting to see how it performs.

You might consider adding some rubber feet, maybe some properly loaded Sorbathane type. Feet not only help with external vibration, but also prevent scratching surfaces.

Best,

Hi.. tx.
I have a set of sorbothane hemisphere pads.. If I remember well dimensioned to stand 15-20kg ... I just doubt it is sorbothane

.. I paid so little for the set on eBay...

Yawns · Post by **Yawns** » Wed Jul 03, 2019 4:20 pm

kaleun96 wrote:....

Thank you for your suggestions and advise...

You just gave me a very useful idea... I have in my box a pair of SMALLRIG Rod Clamp/Dual Railblock - part 942 ...
(hilghlighted in purple)

Screenshot 2019-07-04 at 00.04.50 by antonio caseiro, on Flickr

I can drill a plate in my shed and attach it to the front of the Wemacro stand, using the existent holes ....

Screenshot 2019-07-04 at 00.08.15 by antonio caseiro, on Flickr

That will make the tubes very rigid and keep everything alltogether ...
THANK YOU....

Yawns · Post by **Yawns** » Wed Jul 03, 2019 4:28 pm

This is the moving part ...

V-Slot Gantry Set - Universal 2020 to 2080 - Delrin wheels
to hold the XYZ stage ...

Screenshot 2019-07-03 at 23.15.01 by antonio caseiro, on Flickr

Deanimator · Post by **Deanimator** » Wed Jul 03, 2019 6:40 pm

It's an interesting design and should probably work well.

In philosophy if not execution, it's similar to mine, especially how the camera and subject stage are mounted.

The main difference with mine is that the extrusions are only used to mount the camera and subject, whereas you use them for the basic structure. You probably don't have my severe vibration issues. Also mine is designed for quick and easy conversion between horizontal and vertical.

kaleun96 · Post by **kaleun96** » Wed Jul 03, 2019 11:10 pm

Yawns wrote:
kaleun96 wrote:....
Thank you for your suggestions and advise...

You just gave me a very useful idea... I have in my box a pair of SMALLRIG Rod Clamp/Dual Railblock - part 942 ...
(hilghlighted in purple)

I can drill a plate in my shed and attach it to the front of the Wemacro stand, using the existent holes ....

That will make the tubes very rigid and keep everything alltogether ...
THANK YOU....

That's very similar to what I ended up doing too! But I have the bellows on top of that mounting plate so the purple bracket you have there goes up and joins to the bellows. It works very well so should help you here too.

One question, does this assume the rods will move freely inside the dual rod clamp so that when the wemacro stage moves the rods move through the clamp?

Yawns · Post by **Yawns** » Thu Jul 04, 2019 2:20 am

OMG.. that's stifff and doesn't works

I'm at work, I will have a better look tonight.

kaleun96 · Post by **kaleun96** » Thu Jul 04, 2019 2:40 am

Haha yeah it's a tough problem to solve. I will try take a photo of my setup tonight so you can see what I did. I think my setup will add too much height for what you're trying to achieve here but maybe gives you an idea. Playing with those SmallRig parts is a bit like Lego

You just need to find somewhere to mount that dual rod clamp to whatever the #1674 (I think you typed #1764 in your CAD drawing by mistake) baseplate attaches to. Maybe if you had a long cheese plate (e.g. #904) that mounts directly to the top of the Wemacro stage and extends far enough out for the dual rod clamp to attach down to. And your #1674 base plate would also sit on the cheese plate, so that base plate + rod system has two anchor points at a reasonable distance apart.

cmagno · Post by **cmagno** » Thu Jul 04, 2019 5:37 am

Hi Yawns,

My rig is also based on OpenBuilds (from ratrig.com) with an 2080 T-slot extrusion where my mjkzz industrial rail THK KR2001 is fixed and a V-Slot Gantry as a slider with an XYZ Stage.

In the images can still be seen some SmallRig components in the specimen holder that is being expanded to allow the vertical use of the rail.
This construction proves to be very solid and in the current configuration I do not detect any type of vibrations.

The mobility of the v-slot proves very useful in adjusting the different working distances of the lenses or in the preparation of the specimen and the lighting system.

I hope this short presentation helps in collecting ideas.

Best regards/Abraços
Carlos Magno

soldevilla · Post by **soldevilla** » Thu Jul 04, 2019 1:18 pm

I see a problem in this design. Well, two.

That purple plate stiffens the assembly and will prevent the movement of the camera.

I do not understand why moving the flash ligths. They add moving weight and move the camera away from their support. However, since the radiant surface of light is extremely larger than the displacement of the camera, I am sure that leaving fixed the points of light will not influence the final image.

Yawns · Post by **Yawns** » Fri Jul 05, 2019 4:59 am

Yes Soldevilla .. the error was corrected yesterday night. Thank you.

(I forgot to upload to Flicker the screenshot of the CAD alteratin)

As for the flashes, I thought so too. The flashes will advance the entire depth of the stack.. usually 2-4 mm (for the type of photos I make). Of course with magnification the effect will be magnified. What impact will it have on the final photo?? .. We will see. Need to experiment first.

Notice ... this is more of a design concept (but of course I want it to be efficient too). As I said in the first line of the original post, I'm doing this out of hobby and out of curiosity. I'm trying to do a compact thing that leaves the desktop clean and that I only have to unplug the power when I want to transport it ... and also to do this for a reasonable price. I can move the flashes to de frame sidebars and use mini magic-arms or even on platforms with wheels to slide through the bars .. but that greatly increases the price. Maybe I'll do it later.

I spent hours drawing this in CAD, with the most accurate measurements possible to be able to anticipate "problems" and concept mistakes ... but I am sure the next week, when I receive the pieces and start to assemble I will find annoyances that I was not expecting. It's also the beauty of these things ... the challenge.
(for the same money I could buy almost 2 wemacro stands)

All the imputs and criticisms are appreciated and welcome. Let's see where this goes, without loosing sight of the initial idea ... Compact, portable, tidy ... and taking into consideration the cost.

As I said.. if it is a "flop" and doesn't works.. tough tatties.. it was fun to do it at least.