4X Surprise Lens vs Nikon 4x Plan APO Can you tell the diff?

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kaleun96
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Post by kaleun96 »

dolmadis wrote: If the disk creating f4 can be removed then it will need to be replaced with one for f2.
Yeah and I'm not sure where I can source a suitable f2 or so disk for this without making one myself. Open to suggestions.

The price on the outlet3d.eu website is $20USD plus $13USD shipping to Sweden for me.

dickb
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Post by dickb »

RobertOToole wrote:In my experience the APO-Xenoplan, Xenoplan and Xenoplan CCTV Lens are the same lenses housed in different mounts.
I agree that Xenoplan Compact Series and Xenoplan CCTV lenses appear to be the same lenses housed in different barrels - with the proviso that some CCTV versions have a very annoying center (spot) filter as a part of their optical scheme.

I was about to write that APO Xenoplans are not the same as the other Xenoplan designs. The only APO/non APO pair of Xenoplan lenses with similar specs is the 23/1.4, other APO Xenoplans have no direct non APO counterpart AFAIK. I compared the optical schemes of both 23/1.4 Xenoplans:

Image
Image

and they do seem very similar, if not exactly the same. I have never handled the APO Xenoplan, so I can't attest to its optical quality.

dickb
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Post by dickb »

kaleun96 wrote:I've been a fan of this little lens! Bought one from outlet3d last year and noticed it performed well reversed and stacked.

I've just bought a second to see if the aperture disk can be modified and opened up. BTW the f4 version from eBay is cheaper on their website but perhaps the shipping is more.
I have a fixed aperture version of another lens from this series, the 8mm CNG (Cinegon) f/1.4 (2.0). I tried removing the fixed aperture from that lens, without any luck. Maybe the 23/1.3 (4.0) is an easier operation.

dolmadis
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Post by dolmadis »

Is the aperture, whether variable or a fixed disk, sited between the two lens groups?

If so removing a lens group to remove the aperture disk on the f4 version would disturb the lens group seating?

Thanks

BR


John

Macrero
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Post by Macrero »

I have a lot more lenses than I need and use :roll: but I can buy one of the compact model, take it to the lens-workshop of a friends of mine, get the aperture disk removed (if possible) and report back. That would take some time though...
https://500px.com/macrero - Amateurs worry about equipment, Pros worry about money, Masters worry about Light

RobertOToole
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Post by RobertOToole »

dolmadis wrote:
kaleun96 wrote: I've just bought a second to see if the aperture disk can be modified and opened up. BTW the f4 version from eBay is cheaper on their website but perhaps the shipping is more.
I understand that there is no variable aperture in this version of the lens. If the disk creating f4 can be removed then it will need to be replaced with one for f2.

I shall be very interested as will others if this version can be modified.

There were 15 in stock when I looked earlier. Seller is a dealer in Poland.

BR


John
You could remove it and use a paper disk between the two lenses. Just recently I tried that with a preset Componon 4/35. I removed the disk for f2.3 and then stopped it down slightly with a paper disk. Worked great.


SK CNP 35mm at f2.5 or so on 90mm TL.

Image

RobertOToole
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Post by RobertOToole »

kaleun96 wrote:
dolmadis wrote: If the disk creating f4 can be removed then it will need to be replaced with one for f2.
Yeah and I'm not sure where I can source a suitable f2 or so disk for this without making one myself. Open to suggestions.

The price on the outlet3d.eu website is $20USD plus $13USD shipping to Sweden for me.
For a price like that, sounds like a nice project.

Robert

dmillard
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Post by dmillard »

RobertOToole wrote:
Macrero wrote:But not 49mm filter thread.
I thought that would help lead people away :D

The CCTV Xenoplans have a 49mm thread.
Hello Robert,

Here's a link to information about Fujifilm's machine vision lenses, and data on what I think may be a CCTV Xenoplan equivalent lens. Are the Xenoplans you have that massive?

David

Image

RobertOToole
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Post by RobertOToole »

dickb wrote:
RobertOToole wrote:In my experience the APO-Xenoplan, Xenoplan and Xenoplan CCTV Lens are the same lenses housed in different mounts.
I agree that Xenoplan Compact Series and Xenoplan CCTV lenses appear to be the same lenses housed in different barrels - with the proviso that some CCTV versions have a very annoying center (spot) filter as a part of their optical scheme.
I did read that someplace Dick but if I remember correctly that was the faster lenses, the 0.95 versions maybe? You know more and have more experience than me about XNPs that anyone I know.
I was about to write that APO Xenoplans are not the same as the other Xenoplan designs. The only APO/non APO pair of Xenoplan lenses with similar specs is the 23/1.4, other APO Xenoplans have no direct non APO counterpart AFAIK. I compared the optical schemes of both 23/1.4 Xenoplans:

Image
Image

and they do seem very similar, if not exactly the same. I have never handled the APO Xenoplan, so I can't attest to its optical quality.
So far I've found that 3 cases with SK where they sell different lenses where the only difference is the lettering on the barrels.

The 50mm is one case.

The Xenoplan 2.8/50 is now a APO-Xenoplan 2.8/50 and is also the Anti-shading Xenoplan 2.8/50. Looking at the MTFs, they look suspiciously similar to the SK 2.8/50 Componon S.

Xenoplan 2.8/50
APO-Xenoplan 2.8/50
Anti-shading Xenoplan 2.8/50
Componon S 2.8/50

They have the same MTFs and lens data so all four are the same lens internally.


Image

There are two other cases I know of for sure.

At least SK doesn't hide the facts :shock:


Best,

Robert

RobertOToole
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Post by RobertOToole »

dickb wrote:
kaleun96 wrote:I've been a fan of this little lens! Bought one from outlet3d last year and noticed it performed well reversed and stacked.

I've just bought a second to see if the aperture disk can be modified and opened up. BTW the f4 version from eBay is cheaper on their website but perhaps the shipping is more.
I have a fixed aperture version of another lens from this series, the 8mm CNG (Cinegon) f/1.4 (2.0). I tried removing the fixed aperture from that lens, without any luck. Maybe the 23/1.3 (4.0) is an easier operation.
Some SK preset lenses share a common center barrel section. The 4/35 and 4/28 are like that. I own 5 or 6 of these and the center is swappable on all. The ID goes from 4mm up to 12mm.

Robert

dickb
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Post by dickb »

dmillard wrote:Hello Robert,

Here's a link to information about Fujifilm's machine vision lenses, and data on what I think may be a CCTV Xenoplan equivalent lens. Are the Xenoplans you have that massive?

David

Image
I'm not Robert, but I do have Xenoplans in both CCTV and Compact series variants and also a few of these Fujinons. The Fujinons are massive compared to the Schneiders, the CCTV Xenoplans are reasonably large but relatively lightweight , the compact series are small but very dense.

RobertOToole
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Post by RobertOToole »

dolmadis wrote:Is the aperture, whether variable or a fixed disk, sited between the two lens groups?

If so removing a lens group to remove the aperture disk on the f4 version would disturb the lens group seating?

Thanks

BR


John
Yes, some SK lenses all share the same center section with the disk. The section swaps out with other lenses. These are the Cylinder type of SK lenses.

RobertOToole
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Post by RobertOToole »

dmillard wrote:
RobertOToole wrote:
Macrero wrote:But not 49mm filter thread.
I thought that would help lead people away :D

The CCTV Xenoplans have a 49mm thread.
Hello Robert,

Here's a link to information about Fujifilm's machine vision lenses, and data on what I think may be a CCTV Xenoplan equivalent lens. Are the Xenoplans you have that massive?

David

Image
Thanks for the info.

Yes, they are all large sized, but at least 49mm is really easy adapt and more importantly the shroud is really shallow, so the front element is not setback very far, so stacking is easy.

For the price I paid for the lot, I can't complain about anything, one of those deals :D

RobertOToole
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Post by RobertOToole »

dickb wrote: I agree that Xenoplan Compact Series and Xenoplan CCTV lenses appear to be the same lenses housed in different barrels - with the proviso that some CCTV versions have a very annoying center (spot) filter as a part of their optical scheme.
Found it, yes, thanks for pointing that out, the filter was an option thankfully, you can tell by the lens ID code.



Image

RobertOToole
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Post by RobertOToole »

dmillard wrote:Are the Xenoplans you have that massive?
Came across these while searching for the spot filter info.

Thanks again for the PDF link.

Image

Image

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