Thorlabs Breadboard

[blades]

I've been looking at a Thorlabs breadboard to mount my macro set up on. Just wondered if you guys can offer any advice on choosing one please? Is there a particular one being used for this purpose or has been found to be the most useful?

I have a heavy duty bench that has a top measurement of 800mm x 700mm

Is be most grateful for any advice

[Darionett]

I've been looking at a Thorlabs breadboard to mount my macro set up on. Just wondered if you guys can offer any advice on choosing one please? Is there a particular one being used for this purpose or has been found to be the most useful?

I have a heavy duty bench that has a top measurement of 800mm x 700mm

bott.jpeg

Is be most grateful for any advice

Hi,

What magnification would you like to archive? Because in addition to a Breadboard (I found the Thorlabs aluminum 3030, the one with a high density of holes to be very good, while one purchased on Aliexpress was definitely bent and arrived dented), you should consider something to absorb vibrations, such as sorbothane feet and additional weight, such as a granite slab, otherwise you could think directly about a Honeycomb Optical Breadboards.
Best regards,

Dario N.

[enricosavazzi]

I second Darionett's post above for what concerns the general type of breadboard. You probably don't want to spend more on the breadboard than you did (or will do) on photographic equipment to mount on the breadboard, so this excludes most of the heaviest breadboards with a cast-iron core covered on both sides with stainless steel plates, as well as compressed-air suspensions to absorb vibrations. This still leaves plenty of possible choices about breadboard size, thickness and type. The location and type of the work table and whether the floor is subjected to traffic (or even walking) vibrations also requires a careful consideration.

It would definitely help to know what equipment you have available, or plan to purchase to achieve your desired magnification range, as well as an idea of your current expertise in photomacrography. If you are on your first steps in this field, before committing to the purchase of expensive items you should be prepared to do a lot of reading (on this site as well as books and other sources) in order to get a good understanding of the requirements, equipment and methods. Especially at the beginning, mistakes can be costly.

The size of the breadboard depends on the type of setup (e.g. vertical vs. horizontal vs. switchable between either orientation), as well as the minimum and maximum magnifications and the type of optics. If you have not decided on these points, this web site contains plenty of information to help you make an informed decision. In particular there is a thread with pictures of the setups built/used by members of this site. I cannot find it right now, but some other member may pitch in with this information.

[blades]

I've been looking at a Thorlabs breadboard to mount my macro set up on. Just wondered if you guys can offer any advice on choosing one please? Is there a particular one being used for this purpose or has been found to be the most useful?

I have a heavy duty bench that has a top measurement of 800mm x 700mm

bott.jpeg

Is be most grateful for any advice

Hi,

What magnification would you like to archive? Because in addition to a Breadboard (I found the Thorlabs aluminum 3030, the one with a high density of holes to be very good, while one purchased on Aliexpress was definitely bent and arrived dented), you should consider something to absorb vibrations, such as sorbothane feet and additional weight, such as a granite slab, otherwise you could think directly about a Honeycomb Optical Breadboards.
Best regards,

Dario N.

Thank you for the response, currently I have been using an Am Scope 4X Achromatic Microscope Objective, but I retired recently and now have more time available so intend to buy a 5x and 10x Mitutoyu. I appreciate your advice.

[blades]

I second Darionett's post above for what concerns the general type of breadboard. You probably don't want to spend more on the breadboard than you did (or will do) on photographic equipment to mount on the breadboard, so this excludes most of the heaviest breadboards with a cast-iron core covered on both sides with stainless steel plates, as well as compressed-air suspensions to absorb vibrations. This still leaves plenty of possible choices about breadboard size, thickness and type. The location and type of the work table and whether the floor is subjected to traffic (or even walking) vibrations also requires a careful consideration.

It would definitely help to know what equipment you have available, or plan to purchase to achieve your desired magnification range, as well as an idea of your current expertise in photomacrography. If you are on your first steps in this field, before committing to the purchase of expensive items you should be prepared to do a lot of reading (on this site as well as books and other sources) in order to get a good understanding of the requirements, equipment and methods. Especially at the beginning, mistakes can be costly.

The size of the breadboard depends on the type of setup (e.g. vertical vs. horizontal vs. switchable between either orientation), as well as the minimum and maximum magnifications and the type of optics. If you have not decided on these points, this web site contains plenty of information to help you make an informed decision. In particular there is a thread with pictures of the setups built/used by members of this site. I cannot find it right now, but some other member may pitch in with this information.

Thank you, I appreciate your detailed response.
I was out of the hobby for sometime as I got posted overseas.. now back in the UK and retired, I have time get going again and continue from where I left off. It's mainly beetles and spiders that I photograph.
Equipment wise, well easier to just list it.

Sony A7r2 body
Olympus OM-1 mkII
Olympus 60mm F2.8
Olympus 90mm F3.5
AK Diffusser
Raynox and a AmScope 4x microscope objective
WeMacro autorail
WeMacro vertical/horizontal stand
Novaflex Castel-Q
2x Godox V350o
Smallrig RM01 mini LED Video Light kit (recent purchase, but so far found it extremely useful)
I would like to add a 5x and a 10x Mitutoyu objectives at some point when I can afford them

There is no traffic in the room that I use, other than myself.
Recently, I have been using the OM-1 mkII with the 90mm lens and I've been really surprised with the results using the in camera focus stacking. Id like to experiment and try is with the Raynox and objectives to see what the results are? I know what I get from my older Sony body. Long term, I may sell the Sony once I see what results I can achieve with my OM-1 mkII. If I find I cannot get similar results, I may keep my Sony for the studio stuff and the Olympus for outdoors.

[WojTek]

Hi Blades ,

I know that there are a lot of rumours and stereotypes on this subject.
In my experience, the weight of the desk plays practically no role.
But it should not wobble :-)

I use a very light desk on which my ultra-light setup stands.
I have been taking photos for a few years now
and I have not been able to register any external vibrations.

It's much more important that the camera doesn't cause any vibrations
and that a pause is made after moving the rail until everything calms down.

However, if there are really strong vibrations coming from outside,
it is recommended to use short exposure times, e.g. flashes with minimum power.

Best, Wojtek

[enricosavazzi]

[..]
Thank you, I appreciate your detailed response.
I was out of the hobby for sometime as I got posted overseas.. now back in the UK and retired, I have time get going again and continue from where I left off. It's mainly beetles and spiders that I photograph.
Equipment wise, well easier to just list it.

Sony A7r2 body
Olympus OM-1 mkII
Olympus 60mm F2.8
Olympus 90mm F3.5
AK Diffusser
Raynox and a AmScope 4x microscope objective
WeMacro autorail
WeMacro vertical/horizontal stand
Novaflex Castel-Q
2x Godox V350o
Smallrig RM01 mini LED Video Light kit (recent purchase, but so far found it extremely useful)
I would like to add a 5x and a 10x Mitutoyu objectives at some point when I can afford them

You are pretty much set up for macro up to 2x with the OM-1 II and Olympus lenses. I have no direct experience with the AmScope 4x (different models seem to exist), but worth testing and getting hands-on experience before switching to a Mitutoyo 5x. As an alternative to the Mitutoyo 5x, I usually recommend considering a Laowa 25 mm 2.5x-5x, which is cheaper, ready to use out-of-the-box (no tube lens, extension rings etc needed) and complements almost exactly the magnification range of your Olympus 90 mm. The Olympus 60 mm can always come in handy when you need a lighter and smaller kit, e.g. for field work, excursions and travel, and you don't anticipate a need to reach 2x.

There is no traffic in the room that I use, other than myself.

I am referring to street traffic outside the building. I have a direct experience with living for a year in an apartment about 50 m away from a street and with particularly springy floors (partly held up by wood beams). There was no mistake feeling the vibrations of passing lorries in my legs, and to use a 600 mm on a tripod I had to wait for a lull in street traffic and take care not to shift my weight from one foot to the other during the exposure.

Recently, I have been using the OM-1 mkII with the 90mm lens and I've been really surprised with the results using the in camera focus stacking. Id like to experiment and try is with the Raynox and objectives to see what the results are? I know what I get from my older Sony body. Long term, I may sell the Sony once I see what results I can achieve with my OM-1 mkII. If I find I cannot get similar results, I may keep my Sony for the studio stuff and the Olympus for outdoors.

It does not hurt trying the Raynox on your two macro lenses, at least you will know what to expect if the need comes.

If I remember correctly, the AmScope 4x is a finite objective and needs no tube lens, so not combined with the Raynox.

I also happen to have an Olympus OM-1 and Sony A7R2 (and an extended-spectrum-converted A72). I found the Sony 90 mm macro optically quite poor, in case you might be tempted to purchase one. I sold the 90 mm without regrets and now use the A7R2 with Laowa macro lenses (105 and 25 mm) and the CoastalOpt 60 mm. The main difference between the OM1 (II) and the Sony in practical results, apart from the slightly different frame proportions and the obvious difference in pixel count, is that the Sony has a slightly better preserved detail and slightly lower noise in dark areas under poor illumination. If there is plenty of light and the A7R2 images are scaled down to 20 Mpixel, the difference is minimal or undetectable (except for a slightly more saturated color rendition, as characteristic of all Olympus cameras). Pretty much my only uses for the A7R2 these days are when I need to test a full-frame lens, or the very rare cases in which 20 Mpixels are not enough and pixel-shifting is not practical, or when I need to take pictures of photographic equipment that include the OM-1.

Yet another reason why I prefer the Micro 4/3 format is that it attaches to microscopes via adapters devoid of optics, with the objectives and tube lens directly projecting the image onto the camera sensor. This is far cheaper and more compact than microscope adapters for full-frame cameras.

[blades]

[..]
Thank you, I appreciate your detailed response.
I was out of the hobby for sometime as I got posted overseas.. now back in the UK and retired, I have time get going again and continue from where I left off. It's mainly beetles and spiders that I photograph.
Equipment wise, well easier to just list it.

Sony A7r2 body
Olympus OM-1 mkII
Olympus 60mm F2.8
Olympus 90mm F3.5
AK Diffusser
Raynox and a AmScope 4x microscope objective
WeMacro autorail
WeMacro vertical/horizontal stand
Novaflex Castel-Q
2x Godox V350o
Smallrig RM01 mini LED Video Light kit (recent purchase, but so far found it extremely useful)
I would like to add a 5x and a 10x Mitutoyu objectives at some point when I can afford them

You are pretty much set up for macro up to 2x with the OM-1 II and Olympus lenses. I have no direct experience with the AmScope 4x (different models seem to exist), but worth testing and getting hands-on experience before switching to a Mitutoyo 5x. As an alternative to the Mitutoyo 5x, I usually recommend considering a Laowa 25 mm 2.5x-5x, which is cheaper, ready to use out-of-the-box (no tube lens, extension rings etc needed) and complements almost exactly the magnification range of your Olympus 90 mm. The Olympus 60 mm can always come in handy when you need a lighter and smaller kit, e.g. for field work, excursions and travel, and you don't anticipate a need to reach 2x.

There is no traffic in the room that I use, other than myself.

I am referring to street traffic outside the building. I have a direct experience with living for a year in an apartment about 50 m away from a street and with particularly springy floors (partly held up by wood beams). There was no mistake feeling the vibrations of passing lorries in my legs, and to use a 600 mm on a tripod I had to wait for a lull in street traffic and take care not to shift my weight from one foot to the other during the exposure.

Recently, I have been using the OM-1 mkII with the 90mm lens and I've been really surprised with the results using the in camera focus stacking. Id like to experiment and try is with the Raynox and objectives to see what the results are? I know what I get from my older Sony body. Long term, I may sell the Sony once I see what results I can achieve with my OM-1 mkII. If I find I cannot get similar results, I may keep my Sony for the studio stuff and the Olympus for outdoors.

It does not hurt trying the Raynox on your two macro lenses, at least you will know what to expect if the need comes.

If I remember correctly, the AmScope 4x is a finite objective and needs no tube lens, so not combined with the Raynox.

I also happen to have an Olympus OM-1 and Sony A7R2 (and an extended-spectrum-converted A72). I found the Sony 90 mm macro optically quite poor, in case you might be tempted to purchase one. I sold the 90 mm without regrets and now use the A7R2 with Laowa macro lenses (105 and 25 mm) and the CoastalOpt 60 mm. The main difference between the OM1 (II) and the Sony in practical results, apart from the slightly different frame proportions and the obvious difference in pixel count, is that the Sony has a slightly better preserved detail and slightly lower noise in dark areas under poor illumination. If there is plenty of light and the A7R2 images are scaled down to 20 Mpixel, the difference is minimal or undetectable (except for a slightly more saturated color rendition, as characteristic of all Olympus cameras). Pretty much my only uses for the A7R2 these days are when I need to test a full-frame lens, or the very rare cases in which 20 Mpixels are not enough and pixel-shifting is not practical, or when I need to take pictures of photographic equipment that include the OM-1.

Yet another reason why I prefer the Micro 4/3 format is that it attaches to microscopes via adapters devoid of optics, with the objectives and tube lens directly projecting the image onto the camera sensor. This is far cheaper and more compact than microscope adapters for full-frame cameras.

Thank you so much for all the information. Only after this post, with your name teasing me for some reason did I realise who you are… I have your book.

[blades]

Hi Blades ,

I know that there are a lot of rumours and stereotypes on this subject.
In my experience, the weight of the desk plays practically no role.
But it should not wobble :-)

I use a very light desk on which my ultra-light setup stands.
I have been taking photos for a few years now
and I have not been able to register any external vibrations.

It's much more important that the camera doesn't cause any vibrations
and that a pause is made after moving the rail until everything calms down.

However, if there are really strong vibrations coming from outside,
it is recommended to use short exposure times, e.g. flashes with minimum power.

Best, Wojtek

Thank you

[blades]

[..]
Thank you, I appreciate your detailed response.
I was out of the hobby for sometime as I got posted overseas.. now back in the UK and retired, I have time get going again and continue from where I left off. It's mainly beetles and spiders that I photograph.
Equipment wise, well easier to just list it.

Sony A7r2 body
Olympus OM-1 mkII
Olympus 60mm F2.8
Olympus 90mm F3.5
AK Diffusser
Raynox and a AmScope 4x microscope objective
WeMacro autorail
WeMacro vertical/horizontal stand
Novaflex Castel-Q
2x Godox V350o
Smallrig RM01 mini LED Video Light kit (recent purchase, but so far found it extremely useful)
I would like to add a 5x and a 10x Mitutoyu objectives at some point when I can afford them

You are pretty much set up for macro up to 2x with the OM-1 II and Olympus lenses. I have no direct experience with the AmScope 4x (different models seem to exist), but worth testing and getting hands-on experience before switching to a Mitutoyo 5x. As an alternative to the Mitutoyo 5x, I usually recommend considering a Laowa 25 mm 2.5x-5x, which is cheaper, ready to use out-of-the-box (no tube lens, extension rings etc needed) and complements almost exactly the magnification range of your Olympus 90 mm. The Olympus 60 mm can always come in handy when you need a lighter and smaller kit, e.g. for field work, excursions and travel, and you don't anticipate a need to reach 2x.

Have you used the Laowa 25mm 2.5x-5x with the OM1 mkII? I never really considered it. I assume you use a Nikon F version and then the Nikon F to MIcro Four Thirds adapter? I would be interested to know how’s you feel it compares to a Mitutoyo 5x if you have?
Thank you in advance

[schwarzvogel]

Hi Blades ,
...
I use a very light desk on which my ultra-light setup stands.
I have been taking photos for a few years now
and I have not been able to register any external vibrations.
...
Best, Wojtek

I am in the same situation.
I use lightning to eliminate influences from external shocks.
Regards schwarzvogel

[CrispyBee]

Have you used the Laowa 25mm 2.5x-5x with the OM1 mkII? I never really considered it. I assume you use a Nikon F version and then the Nikon F to MIcro Four Thirds adapter? I would be interested to know how’s you feel it compares to a Mitutoyo 5x if you have?
Thank you in advance

https://www.closeuphotography.com/laowa ... -lens-test

Robert did some tests with the Laowa 25mm and compared it to the Mitutoyo 5x - you have to scroll down a bit

Personally I'd go for the Mitutoyo on MFT, Centre and APS-C look far better and cleaner and you get a wider aperture.

[blades]

Have you used the Laowa 25mm 2.5x-5x with the OM1 mkII? I never really considered it. I assume you use a Nikon F version and then the Nikon F to MIcro Four Thirds adapter? I would be interested to know how’s you feel it compares to a Mitutoyo 5x if you have?
Thank you in advance

https://www.closeuphotography.com/laowa ... -lens-test

Robert did some tests with the Laowa 25mm and compared it to the Mitutoyo 5x - you have to scroll down a bit

Personally I'd go for the Mitutoyo on MFT, Centre and APS-C look far better and cleaner and you get a wider aperture.

Thank you

[enricosavazzi]

Have you used the Laowa 25mm 2.5x-5x with the OM1 mkII? I never really considered it. I assume you use a Nikon F version and then the Nikon F to MIcro Four Thirds adapter? I would be interested to know how’s you feel it compares to a Mitutoyo 5x if you have?
Thank you in advance

https://www.closeuphotography.com/laowa ... -lens-test

Robert did some tests with the Laowa 25mm and compared it to the Mitutoyo 5x - you have to scroll down a bit

Personally I'd go for the Mitutoyo on MFT, Centre and APS-C look far better and cleaner and you get a wider aperture.

Yes, I have the Laowa in Nikon F mount and switch camera adapters. The Laowa 25 mm is designed for full frame, and using it on Micro 4/3 leaves most of the image circle unused. It is still usable on Micro 4/3, especially considering its compact size, convenience of use and reasonable price, but the Mitutoyo M Plan Apo 5x with a good tube lens is better on Micro 4/3.

I can mention that I have had some success using the OM System 40-150 f/4 Pro as a tube lens (at 150 mm, giving 7.5x) with the Mitutoyo M Plan Apo 10x. In this way one can use the OM-1 in-camera focus bracketing and shoot a stack of 160 shots with fully electronic shutter and continuous illumination in a few seconds. The images must then be moved to a computer and stacked with e.g. Zerene Stacker. It may work also with the Mitutoyo 5x, but I have not tried. See http://www.photomacrography.net/forum/v ... 00#p300700

Not all Olympus/OM System lenses seem to work acceptably when used as tube lenses. The linked thread mentions the OM System 90 mm macro as probably not being suitable. The OM System 40-150 f/4 as a tube lens is less sharp than a proper tube lens. Its advantage is the speed of focus bracketing.

[PeteM]

I've been looking at a Thorlabs breadboard to mount my macro set up on . . .

Once you have a sketch of what you want, there's the option of buying a thick and flat aluminum plate, then drilling and tapping holes where you need them. To me, breadboards are for quick changes and prototyping, not a finished product.

I'd be inclined to buy a right-sized aluminum plate, lay out a grid on it, drill clearance holes, and then use a spiral point tap in a cordless hand drill (with a clutch) and the tap running through a guide block to keep it vertical. Use some tappling fluid, and it goes very fast. Need another tapped hole later? Easy.

Add aluminum black treatment or dead black camo paint when you're happy with the locations. This approach will take maybe a couple of hours, but save a couple hundred dollars.

A heavy plate with appropriate isolation under it can help damp vibrations if that's a problem.