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Monitor calibration.
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DaveW



Joined: 04 Aug 2006
Posts: 1702
Location: Nottingham, UK

PostPosted: Fri Jun 20, 2008 11:15 am    Post subject: Monitor calibration. Reply with quote

Since it was suggested we ought to start a separate thread on monitor calibration I will start it off with these reviews I have just found, as my previous post started the discussion:-

http://www.behardware.com/articles/626-1/monitor-calibration-for-0-to-100.html

http://www.outbackphoto.com/color_management/cm_08/essay.html

http://www.imaging-resource.com/ARTS/MONCAL/CALIBRATE.HTM

DaveW
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lauriek
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Joined: 25 Nov 2007
Posts: 2404
Location: South East UK

PostPosted: Mon Jun 23, 2008 2:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for those links Dave! I managed to get at least the brightness/contrast setup properly now using the light/dark patches on the last of your links.

this is a link back to the cacti thread which started the whole discussion, there's also some info in there... (I know you know this Dave, this is for anyone else who happens across this thread in future!)

ETA I found this yesterday, Firefox 3 now supports colour profiles, but you have to enable it...
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rovebeetle



Joined: 22 May 2008
Posts: 308
Location: Vienna, Austria

PostPosted: Mon Jun 23, 2008 10:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

lauriek wrote:
ETA I found this yesterday, Firefox 3 now supports colour profiles, but you have to enable it...


Right, but currently this is relevant only for a disappearingly small minority of users since most images on the web are still sRGB.
But they are clearly thinking ahead.

Right now, it is particularly important for those who use wide gamut monitors to display these sRGB pics correctly. If sRGB images are displayed on a wide gamut monitor set up and calibrated for Adobe RGB these will show a shift towards the red end of the spectrum.

Cheers
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Harry
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DaveW



Joined: 04 Aug 2006
Posts: 1702
Location: Nottingham, UK

PostPosted: Wed Jun 25, 2008 8:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

There is also a free colour management download here:-

http://www.nativedigital.co.uk/shop/page.php/5234e9a69cbc2508497e633785504a69?xPage=support_general_cm.html

Edit: as on some peoples monitors my blacks came out as grey I have just bought an Eye-One LT (The same as Eye-One Display 2 but with simplified more basic software which can be upgraded to 2 standard later if required).

This gets better write-up's than most of the Spyder's. I will see how it works when I get it. At least I will then know hopefully if you are not getting black backgrounds it's your monitor that is over bright and needs calibrating not mine! Laughing

See:-

http://www.computer-darkroom.com/i12/i12_page_1.htm

DaveW
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DaveW



Joined: 04 Aug 2006
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Location: Nottingham, UK

PostPosted: Fri Jun 27, 2008 9:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Now I'm puzzled! I finally got my Eye-One Display LT set up and it gave my monitor a "Pass" first time with no adjustments needed that I can detect. I ran my cactus picture again and the background is still perfectly black.

That can mean only three things as I see it.

1. I have done the test incorrectly.

2. The device is either rubbish or faulty.

3. Those who saw the background of my image as grey have their monitors set too bright, or incorrectly calibrated, and need to purchase a proper calibrator rather than just set them up by eye, since their colours and grey scale settings are evidently not industry standard..

I would have thought the device should be accurate as it is made by X-Rite / GretagMacbeth who are acknowledged specialists in colour calibration.

Doing some more checking to make sure.

DaveW
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lauriek
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Joined: 25 Nov 2007
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 27, 2008 9:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dave,

From my end no3 is entirely possible!!

Will be interested to hear what others have to say as I have not yet decided whether to save up for one of these colorimeters or not!!
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DaveW



Joined: 04 Aug 2006
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Location: Nottingham, UK

PostPosted: Fri Jun 27, 2008 10:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have just sent an e-mail with my cactus image in question attached to X-Rite and asked if the background is black or not, or if I am not using the equipment properly. I will post the results if they reply.

DaveW
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rovebeetle



Joined: 22 May 2008
Posts: 308
Location: Vienna, Austria

PostPosted: Fri Jun 27, 2008 10:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dave,
1) Have you calibrated your monitor before, let's say with Adobe Gamma?
In that case you have to remove the Adobe Gamma loader from the start up menu as it overrides any profile contrived by the GMB device/software.
Even if not, remove the Adobe Gamma loader anyway.
Maybe that is the reason why you do not notice any change.

2) Have you run the automated calibration or the advanced option?
Anyway, you have to tell the software (iMatch3 in my case) what you are aiming at - usually 6500K and 120-140cd/cm².

In the automated option it only adjusts the colors but the brightness remains more or less untouched. In addition it usually tells you to set the contrast to the highest value (which is nonsense in many cases).
The advanced option stops at several points to take measurements (brightness, contrast and settings of each individual color channel-provided your montior is modern enough that the OSD has that option) and reports back in real time so you can make adjustments (which you have to do manually in the montiors OSD. After that it does the actual calibration. At the end of the process it tells you whether you have achieved your aim or not.
My monitor is calibrated to 6500K and 140cd/cm² - to achieve that I had to reduce the brightness to 23% so it can hardly be too bright. Next time I recalibrate I will try to lower the brightness to 120cd/cm² (the value most professional graphic editors use) and see if whites are still white or already greyish Smile .

Hope that helps

Cheers
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Harry
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augusthouse



Joined: 16 Sep 2006
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Location: New South Wales Australia

PostPosted: Fri Jun 27, 2008 5:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Dave,
I haven't used the X-Rite Eye-One; but removing any other utilities such as Adobe Gamma from the 'startup' menu is important as Harry mentioned. Another point that I need to do when initially calibrating with the Spyder3 is to reset the monitor back to the factory default settings via the OSD. The monitor needs to be on for a period of about thirty minutes for the temperature to stablise before commencing calibration.

Also, via Operating System Display Settings check to see if your system is now using the Eye-One generated colour profile as the default for your monitor.

Craig
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rovebeetle



Joined: 22 May 2008
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Location: Vienna, Austria

PostPosted: Fri Jun 27, 2008 10:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I forgot to mention something important.
In the original cactus post, Rick has pointed out that the back ground is not really black and also not uniformly black. Regardless whether you have calibrated your monitor or not, or whether it's to dark or bright, the numbers do not lie.
If you have Photoshop, open the information palette, then choose, e.g. the color picker and move it over the respective parts. In the information palette you can watch the numbers change for each color channel. If you know how to read these numbers correctly you can also detect color casts and correct them even if the monitor calibration is off.

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Harry
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DaveW



Joined: 04 Aug 2006
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 28, 2008 8:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

No Harry I don't have Photoshop, I use Elements 5. I have not altered the monitor settings so they are still on their manufacturers default ones. I have never even used the menu to alter any of the settings since I got it. It looked as if it was set up just nice for brightness, contrast etc for my eyes. But the point is can we rely on our eyes or do we need to use calibrators?

I am a great believer in "if it aint broke don't fix it" and do not muck about with either computers or cameras settings as a matter of course because I think I know better than the manufacturer, who has no doubt run very extensive tests to find the best settings. That said of course the monitor (or camera) may not get adjusted to those "ideal" settings by the operator on the production line.

I have never used Adobe Gamma Craig and I don't think it will be in my start up menu unless it has self installed?

Anyway, whilst waiting for X-Rite's Support Department to start again Monday I ran the test and photographed the results on the screen. The numbers are "gobbledygook" to me but those of you who understand them can possibly pass an opinion?



Sorry about the Moire patterns etc but it is a photo direct off screen.

DaveW
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rovebeetle



Joined: 22 May 2008
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 29, 2008 6:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dave, this simply looks like a measurement read-out to me - never seen that when I calibrated my monitor. What software did you use ? And has it created a profile? i1 usually works in conjunction with iMatch, and the difference between i1 display LT and i1 display 2 is simply that LT has less options to choose from as regards K, gamma, etc.
The profiling software is the same for both devices.

BTW - I cannot interprete the numbers either (definitely not RGB or CMY numbers) - usually XYZ stand for hue, saturation and brightness.

Cheers
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Harry
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DaveW



Joined: 04 Aug 2006
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 29, 2008 8:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It was the latest i1 software their Support Department told me to download Harry as I am using Vista Home Premium:-

http://www.xrite.com/product_overview.aspx?ID=758&Action=support&SoftwareID=724

When I had downloaded it I got a quick-start icon on the desktop which when clicked on produces this first screen:-



I am told to put the puck on a plain surface, click the arrow at the top of the screen and a pop-up box comes up asking whether my screen is LCD or CRT. I click LCD for my Dell Flat Panel monitor and am asked to hang the puck in the centre of the screen and click the arrow again and this screen comes up:-



When I click on the arrow it goes through a series of colours plus white grey and black and comes out with that numerical read-our on my previous post, plus asks if I want to keep the profile.

As you can see the screen shots are nothing like those on the tutorial of the CD, and at no stage am I given the choice of quick or advanced settings.

I have sent the full set of screen shots to i1 Support as they asked for more details, but they said they would not be back into the office until Monday. Will see if they can sort out what is happening. According to the CD I should be getting those screens in the link in my first post when I started this thread.

DaveW
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rovebeetle



Joined: 22 May 2008
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 29, 2008 9:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I see.
I would suggest to go to their website (www.xrite.com)and register your product, then you can download iMatch (I think 3.6.2 is the latest version) for Vista. I can't locate the posts now but I can remember having read of similar issues on a German website.

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Harry
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DaveW



Joined: 04 Aug 2006
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 29, 2008 9:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you click on the link in my previous post Harry you will see the download I did was 3.6.2.

Will have to see what X-Rite Support says on Monday.

A friend of mine says:-

"Last week I was going through my Speed Graphic Summer 2008 catalogue for filters. I noticed in their intro a section on Colour Management where they stated Monaco, Gretag Macbeth, Colorvision and Pantone have gone to the wall."

But from X-Rite's site it seems they actually took Gretag Macbeth over, so how accurate the catalogue was about the others I do not know:-

http://www.xrite.com/top_company.aspx

Thanks,

Dave
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