Mitty M Plan Apo 5x vs. Laowa 25mm F/2.8 2.5x-5x ultra macro

Adalbert · Post by **Adalbert** » Tue Nov 13, 2018 10:19 am

Hello everybody,
Where can I find the battle of these lenses ?
Hasn’t anybody compared these lenses up to now?
BR, ADi

Lou Jost · Post by **Lou Jost** » Tue Nov 13, 2018 10:46 am

I really like the Laowa for its zoom convenience and its large image circle. It is not as good as a really good microscope objective in the center, though. Maybe I'll have time to prepare a careful test soon, but I hope someone else will beat me to it...

Adalbert · Post by **Adalbert** » Tue Nov 13, 2018 2:00 pm

Hi Lou,

Maybe I'll have time to prepare

I’m looking forward to it :-)
BR, ADi

Lou Jost · Post by **Lou Jost** » Tue Nov 13, 2018 6:53 pm

Here's a quick unscientific test on an Olympus MFT sensor with high pixel pitch. This is a good way to check center sharpness. The Laowa is f/2.8, so for magnifications around 5x, the effective aperture is around 16, or more if the Laowa has to be stopped down half a stop to minimize lens aberrations. This means that diffraction will reduce the sharpness of the image. I can get almost the same FOV (on MFT) with a 10x Mitu 0.28 pushed down to 5.5x on a Scitex S-3 110mm tube lens (following a suggestion by Robert O'Toole). This has an effective aperture of about f/10 so it will be much sharper than the Laowa.

Here is the whole MFT image from the Laowa at 5x, with no sharpening or level adjustment or anything else:

Here is a 100% crop:

And here is a 100% crop of the image of the same subject using the 10x Mitu on the 110mm Scitex S-3 scanner lens to get 5.5x magnification:

Note how much more detail this image contains, particularly resolving the scale ridges.

Nevertheless the Laowa image covers FF, whereas the pushed-down Mitu 10x does not. On FF we'd have to compare the 5x 0.14, with an effective aperture of 17, close to that of the Laowa. So on FF there would not be such a difference.

Adalbert · Post by **Adalbert** » Wed Nov 14, 2018 4:49 am

Hi Lou,
Many thanks for the test!
OK, Laowa doesn’t have any chance vs. Mitty 10x pushed down.
But really fair would be to compare Laowa vs. Mitty 5x both with FF and both with CROP :-)
BR, ADi

santiago · Post by **santiago** » Wed Nov 14, 2018 6:29 am

Nice test, thanks! What was the aperture used with the Laowa?

Lou Jost · Post by **Lou Jost** » Wed Nov 14, 2018 6:31 am

Adalbert, You are right, that would be the fair way. But I don't have a 5x Mitutoyo....

I really like the Laowa on FF for its convenience. Would not use it on MFT in the studio, though maybe in the field for live subjects. APS is intermediate, might use it there at lower m for its convenience. It has great WD (40-45mm) and it is easy to change magnifications continuously over a wide range.

Santiago, I used a setting midway between 2.8 and 4. Did not test for best aperture, but if I had stopped it down much more than that, it would have done badly at 5x on MFT even if it was a perfect lens.

santiago · Post by **santiago** » Wed Nov 14, 2018 6:53 am

Lou Jost wrote:Santiago, I used a setting midway between 2.8 and 4. Did not test for best aperture, but if I had stopped it down much more than that, it would have done badly at 5x on MFT even if it was a perfect lens.

Ok, thanks.

My brother bought this lens for me as a present but I still don't have it. I'm going to Buenos Aires for 2 weeks in December and will finally be able to put my hands on it, I'm very curious about this lens. I've seen some sample images and it looks promising with good IQ.

I would also use it in the field with live subjects, just like the mp-e 65...

Lou Jost · Post by **Lou Jost** » Wed Nov 14, 2018 6:56 am

Santiago, yes, that's what it is really good for, fieldwork. It is lightweight relative to alternatives and the long WD and narrow front element should make it easy to use. If only it could do quick focus stacking like some native macro lenses!

JohnyM · Post by **JohnyM** » Wed Nov 14, 2018 7:48 am

Question. Does it changes it's working distance in erratic and unexpected way just like Mp-e 65? EDIT: i should say MFD.

One of the reasons im phasing out Mp-E65 from studio work is the need for constant HUGE readjustment of rail position along with magnification change.
Second reason is it's flexibility - too much of it. Every stack requires calibration shot for scalebar. My new system will be 1x / 3x / 5x fixed, maybe with magnification changer.

Keeping it for fieldwork tho (which lured me into macrophotography, but which i dont do at all nowdays).

Lou Jost · Post by **Lou Jost** » Wed Nov 14, 2018 8:10 am

The Laowa has an easy magnification scale so you can quickly get to a set integer m.

The length changes monotonically with respect to m. WD does not change much thoughout the zoom range (maybe 5mm). The manufacturers missed a chance to make their lens more useful; if they had made a tripod collar fixed to near the front of the lens, the lens would hardly need to be moved during zooming. However, because the tripod collar attaches to the rear of the lens, the camera has to be repositioned over quite a long distance during zooming. It might be possible to make a home-made tripod collar for near the front of the lens, though that part turns to control the aperture. It is very sturdy though. If you used a fixed aperture during zooming (which you probably would if you were stacking), this mounting would work, but it would take practice to zoom without accidentally changing the aperture.

Adalbert · Post by **Adalbert** » Wed Nov 14, 2018 9:10 am

Hi Lou,

I really like the Laowa on FF for its convenience

I'm thinking of purchasing either a Mitty 5x or Laowa :-)
BR, ADi

RobertOToole · Post by **RobertOToole** » Wed Nov 14, 2018 9:19 pm

Adalbert wrote:Hi Lou,
I really like the Laowa on FF for its convenience
I'm thinking of purchasing either a Mitty 5x or Laowa :-)
BR, ADi

Hi ADi,

Feel free to ship a Laowa to me and I would be happy to test it against my M Plan 5x.

Most shops here in the US give you the privilege to return the item if you are not satisfied with the performance. Once I bought the Mitakon Zhongyi 20mm f/2 4.5x Super Macro lens and after 5 minutes of shooting I stopped, put it back in the box and returned it the same day. The lens performance was just terrible.

Robert

santiago · Post by **santiago** » Thu Nov 15, 2018 1:39 am

Lou Jost wrote:Santiago, yes, that's what it is really good for, fieldwork. It is lightweight relative to alternatives and the long WD and narrow front element should make it easy to use. If only it could do quick focus stacking like some native macro lenses!

Ok, thanks for the info!

Macro_Cosmos · Post by **Macro_Cosmos** » Thu Nov 15, 2018 3:51 am

I've compared them, just have to find the photos, it's on a dead harddrive... just replaced it.

Long story short, the 5x mit has more resolution. Sharpness of the Laowa is on-par with the 5x mit.

The laowa covers 2.5x-5x. Moderate LoCA, WD is about 45mm at 2.5x and 40 at 5x.

Laowa 25mm is half the price of a new Mit. Not going to comment on used copies, they go anywhere from unusable to not bad, variation and luck factor is uncontrollable.

Edit: Found the comparisons, uploading them.