Minolta CE 30mm F 2.8

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austrokiwi1
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Minolta CE 30mm F 2.8

Post by austrokiwi1 »

I gave up hunting out new lenses some time back, but! There is one enlarger lens I had always been intrigued with, the CE 30/2.8. I have always wondered how this lens would perform in macro work. Over the last 2-3 years I have kept an infrequent watch out for a suitable example. Finally a near new boxed example came up for sale locally at a price that was reasonable( Euro 80.00). The price I paid might seem steep but some eBay sellers seem to have very optimistic views on what they can sell the lens for. I recall one very badly soiled example being sold with an asking price above US$100.00. I have had the lens for nearly 2 months and I finally got around to testing it over the last few days. I really wasn't expecting much. My previous experience with a Minolta enlarging lens was with the 75/4.5, it was a shocking performer. The CE 30/2.8 was a much better experience.

Image

Note the brown insulation tape is holding a 48mm to 49mm stepping ring in place( this lens doesn't have a filter thread) for mounting a reversing adapter.

It is designed for the 16 mm film format. Mounted normally it is only useful on a MFT camera. The following is a shot taken at just under half sized magnification ( I was quite impressed with this result)



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According to the original paper work that came with the lens it is a gauss design( no surprise there) of 6 elements in 5 groups. According to what I found on the internet it is designed to produce enlargements of up to 26X. That apparently doesn't extend to a magnification of 26 times. A flicker post on the lens( which I can't re-find) noted that the lens appeared to work best up to around 8X when reversed. Certainly my experience with the lens confirmed that at about 9X the resolution had deteriorated.

I did some basic tests using both a Euro 10 bank note and a USAF 1951 resolution target for the following shots I used a Sony A7rii with the lens reversed. It comfortably covers a full frame sensor reversed so long as magnification is higher than 3X. From what I could tell the field is flat and corner to corner performance is good.


At 3 Times ( full picture)

Image

At 7.6 Times (center crop)
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I didn't expected it to handle CA very well. I tested it using a calibration slide mounted at 45 Degrees The result was better than the Oly 80mm bellows lens, but still wasn't great:

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I then tried a stack ( Dmap with Zerene) This photo is a photo-bucket link it is a largish file (and reduced for photo bucket)

Image

The subject is the obverse of a Morgan dollar ( American silver coin). I was quite impressed with the result for such a lens. However when compared with the APO SK 40/F2.8 ( at slightly lower magnification) it is clear it is not brilliant. ( Note the two sstacks were taken a few days apart and I didn't use as much halo suppression with the minolta as I should have. Here is the Sk 40 comparison:
Image

I will be sticking with the SK, but this 30/2.8 might make a cheap alternative for someone on a low budget( if you can find one)

Edit: I decided to couple the lens with an Schneider Kreuznach 210/5.6 enlarger lens. I used a bellows to get the extension necessary for infinity focus with the 210. If I recall correctly this pairing gives a magnification of 7X. This shot is reduced for posting here. The uncompressed tiff shows a much better IQ then I was getting with just extension( but not enough for this lens to move from the "collection" shelf):


Image
Still learning,
Cameras' Sony A7rII, OLympus OMD-EM10II
Macro lenses: Printing nikkor 105mm, Sony FE 90mm F2.8 Macro G, Schneider Kreuznach Makro Iris 50mm , 2.8, Schnieder Kreuznach APO Componon HM 40mm F2.8 , Mamiya 645 120mm F4 Macro ( used with mirex tilt shift adapter), Olympus 135mm 4.5 bellows lens, Oly 80mm bellows lens, Olympus 60mm F2.8

ChrisR
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Post by ChrisR »

Nice test.

There were (at least) two common ranges of enlarging Rokkors. As you say, the cheaper 4 element (?) ones were horribly ho hum, but the CE ones (all 6 element I think) are pretty good.

The plastic part of the 30mm varies, as though they were made in different factories, but I think the glass is the same. I have one shoved very tightly into a Cokin adapter to reverse it, which grips it perfectly. The ones I have all fit the same ring. I could dig it out if anyone's interested to know the size.


There were shorter (25mm iirc) Rokkor lenses in their miniature cameras, which again from memory were f/2.8 or f/3.5. I bought a cheap "better" camera . Not easy to take the lens out, at all. It didn't look impressive, either. I mean it looked too cheaply made to be any good, and was too hard to test!
Their 25mm/f/2.5 bellows macro is in a different league - not bad at all.
Chris R

Pau
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Post by Pau »

ChrisR wrote:Their 25mm/f/2.5 bellows macro is in a different league - not bad at all.
Sure, this is a Leitz Photar design!
Pau

ray_parkhurst
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Post by ray_parkhurst »

The Morgan Dollar detail looks really good, with a nice 3D quality to it.

austrokiwi1
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Post by austrokiwi1 »

Pau wrote:
ChrisR wrote:Their 25mm/f/2.5 bellows macro is in a different league - not bad at all.
Sure, this is a Leitz Photar design!
I keep returning to the quoted post. The reason being is that with the 28 mm the optics are very reminiscent of those of the 25mm/2.5 bellows lens. the CE 28mm is a 6 element 5 groups while the 25mm is a 6 element 4 group lens. A comparison between the two lenses would be interesting
Still learning,
Cameras' Sony A7rII, OLympus OMD-EM10II
Macro lenses: Printing nikkor 105mm, Sony FE 90mm F2.8 Macro G, Schneider Kreuznach Makro Iris 50mm , 2.8, Schnieder Kreuznach APO Componon HM 40mm F2.8 , Mamiya 645 120mm F4 Macro ( used with mirex tilt shift adapter), Olympus 135mm 4.5 bellows lens, Oly 80mm bellows lens, Olympus 60mm F2.8

austrokiwi1
Posts: 350
Joined: Sun Sep 14, 2014 10:53 am

Post by austrokiwi1 »

A local expensive second hand camera store has had an example of the Micro Rokkor 25mm F 2.5 sitting on the shelf for a few years. Today I purchased it. I really wanted to see how the CE 30mm measured uup against it. As has been observed in another thread the 25mm seems to produce a more saturated image. It reminds me of the Minolta colors that are typical of the non-macro lenses produced by Minolta. I suspect it is the coating of the lens that is doing this. I am sure the CE rokkor is un-coated, based on my experience that I have to be very careful with the lighting as the CE "flares" easily. Note my version of the micro rokkor is not the X version( Rokkor X was produced for the American market). I leave others to judge. From the full sized images I think the 25mm has the edge ( but not by much)

Image
Still learning,
Cameras' Sony A7rII, OLympus OMD-EM10II
Macro lenses: Printing nikkor 105mm, Sony FE 90mm F2.8 Macro G, Schneider Kreuznach Makro Iris 50mm , 2.8, Schnieder Kreuznach APO Componon HM 40mm F2.8 , Mamiya 645 120mm F4 Macro ( used with mirex tilt shift adapter), Olympus 135mm 4.5 bellows lens, Oly 80mm bellows lens, Olympus 60mm F2.8

ray_parkhurst
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Post by ray_parkhurst »

Lighting is different enough between the two that it's tough to compare them. Colors reflected from toned Ag surfaces are highly dependent on lighting angle.

Corner sharpness of the 25mm looks a little better, but it's not a huge difference.

austrokiwi1
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Joined: Sun Sep 14, 2014 10:53 am

Post by austrokiwi1 »

I take the point on the lighting. I redid the CE 30mm stack with exactly the same lighting as the 25mm and then also did another stack with the SK 40mm. I didn't get the coin placement quite right for the 40mm:

After all the stacking I really can't see much difference. I still think the 40mm is the best but given the price differential the CE 30mm impresses:
top is the ce 30mm, middle is the 25mm, bottom is the SK

Image
Still learning,
Cameras' Sony A7rII, OLympus OMD-EM10II
Macro lenses: Printing nikkor 105mm, Sony FE 90mm F2.8 Macro G, Schneider Kreuznach Makro Iris 50mm , 2.8, Schnieder Kreuznach APO Componon HM 40mm F2.8 , Mamiya 645 120mm F4 Macro ( used with mirex tilt shift adapter), Olympus 135mm 4.5 bellows lens, Oly 80mm bellows lens, Olympus 60mm F2.8

ChrisR
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Post by ChrisR »

Center sharpness is what I remember being better on the 25mm f/2.5
Chris R

austrokiwi1
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Joined: Sun Sep 14, 2014 10:53 am

Post by austrokiwi1 »

Just a quick up date. I changed the lighting I was using and found I could get reasonable shots at 12X magnification.
Still learning,
Cameras' Sony A7rII, OLympus OMD-EM10II
Macro lenses: Printing nikkor 105mm, Sony FE 90mm F2.8 Macro G, Schneider Kreuznach Makro Iris 50mm , 2.8, Schnieder Kreuznach APO Componon HM 40mm F2.8 , Mamiya 645 120mm F4 Macro ( used with mirex tilt shift adapter), Olympus 135mm 4.5 bellows lens, Oly 80mm bellows lens, Olympus 60mm F2.8

Macrero
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Post by Macrero »

CE (Color Enlarging) Rokkors are top-of-the-line enlarging lenses made by Minolta. The 2.8/30 and 2.8/50 are 6-elements, 5-groups design, the 5.6/80 is 6-elements, 4-groups. Very sharp and well corrected lenses, every bit as good as any Componon, Rodagon or El-Nikkor. Very underlooked as well.
https://500px.com/macrero - Amateurs worry about equipment, Pros worry about money, Masters worry about Light

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