Sunset moth wing scales

Images taken in a controlled environment or with a posed subject. All subject types.

Moderators: rjlittlefield, ChrisR, Chris S., Pau

Beatsy
Posts: 2105
Joined: Fri Jul 05, 2013 3:10 am
Location: Malvern, UK

Sunset moth wing scales

Post by Beatsy »

I know this has been done to death but you have to have a go, eh? I recently got some Sunset moth wings to tick this particular cliche off my todo list. Here's a crop from the first FF stack I tried today (20x Mitty). I'm definitely going to do some more of these - even if they are "old hat". They're purty! And I'm pretty sure there's more detail to be teased out too. Never content, but always happy... :)
Image

Yawns
Posts: 400
Joined: Sun Dec 20, 2015 9:18 am
Location: Benavente, Portugal

Post by Yawns »

beautiful .. I think it's the first time I see the scales under the scales (transparency) .. in the left bottom corner it's impressive.

Howard Mayo
Posts: 28
Joined: Wed Jun 20, 2018 5:12 am
Location: Saint Paul, MN
Contact:

Post by Howard Mayo »

I agree with Yawns....beautiful.
That's all structural coloration right?
I wonder if even more depth could be teased out with back lighting somehow.
Thanks for sharing, makes me happy too.

davidguitar
Posts: 33
Joined: Sat Jun 23, 2018 7:23 am
Location: Sverige
Contact:

Re: Sunset moth wing scales

Post by davidguitar »

Beatsy wrote:I know this has been done to death but you have to have a go, eh? I recently got some Sunset moth wings to tick this particular cliche off my todo list. Here's a crop from the first FF stack I tried today (20x Mitty). I'm definitely going to do some more of these - even if they are "old hat". They're purty! And I'm pretty sure there's more detail to be teased out too. Never content, but always happy... :)
Image
wow. Nice vibrent colors. well done 8)

Beatsy
Posts: 2105
Joined: Fri Jul 05, 2013 3:10 am
Location: Malvern, UK

Post by Beatsy »

Howard Mayo wrote:I agree with Yawns....beautiful.
That's all structural coloration right?
I wonder if even more depth could be teased out with back lighting somehow.
Thanks for sharing, makes me happy too.
Thanks for the comments all.

Yes, the colours are structural. Thanks to a very kind lady who posted some SEM images for me (elsewhere) I now know the colours are caused by closely spaced "interference" layers in the scales. You never know, she may post those pics here too. Hint, hint :D

With regard to backlighting: there is an underlayer of brown/black "normal" scales on both sides of the wing so I'm not sure how much light would get through (if any), but perhaps worth a look.

anne
Posts: 146
Joined: Fri Dec 05, 2014 11:20 am
Contact:

Post by anne »

Hi Steve,
it is a pleasure to show these SEM images with a big thank you to the NMI Institute in Reutlingen, which has done the images.
First here a (poor) image light microscopy of the cut/cross section of the wing.
We hoped to get more good information with the light microscope, but as you can see, dimensions are too small.
But what we can see in this cross section, there are two layers of scales, brown ones directly under the coloured ones.

Image

Here now the two SEM images. I am not sure if the structure which looks like a wall is responsible for the colour effect. I think they are responsible for stabilization. The structure above, the small walls on the surface could be responsible for the colour.

Image

Image

BR
Anne

Perhaps I can show some more images of the walls on the surface, will first ask if I am allowed to show them.

Oscar_macro
Posts: 28
Joined: Sun Dec 30, 2018 5:49 am

Post by Oscar_macro »

wow very nice!

anne
Posts: 146
Joined: Fri Dec 05, 2014 11:20 am
Contact:

Post by anne »

Hi Steve,
got permission from Bernd to show his wonderful SEM images.
here they are:

Image

Image


Image


Image



And here the difference to the brown scales:

Image

BR
anne

ChrisR
Site Admin
Posts: 8668
Joined: Sat Mar 14, 2009 3:58 am
Location: Near London, UK

Post by ChrisR »

Thank you Anne; remarkable images :shock:. It's a childish question, but I wonder what colour(s) they actually are.
Chris R

Beatsy
Posts: 2105
Joined: Fri Jul 05, 2013 3:10 am
Location: Malvern, UK

Post by Beatsy »

ChrisR wrote:Thank you Anne; remarkable images :shock:. It's a childish question, but I wonder what colour(s) they actually are.
Seconded! Thanks Anne.

I believe the coloured scales are actually transparent and just a very pale orange brown colour when not "interfering"

ChrisR
Site Admin
Posts: 8668
Joined: Sat Mar 14, 2009 3:58 am
Location: Near London, UK

Post by ChrisR »

I guess so - so with a little thought about diffraction I should be able to work out which of those repeating structures are responsible for the colours!
Chris R

Beatsy
Posts: 2105
Joined: Fri Jul 05, 2013 3:10 am
Location: Malvern, UK

Post by Beatsy »

ChrisR wrote:I guess so - so with a little thought about diffraction I should be able to work out which of those repeating structures are responsible for the colours!
And even state what colour they produce - if the scale bar is accurate :D

Lou Jost
Posts: 5947
Joined: Fri Sep 04, 2015 7:03 am
Location: Ecuador
Contact:

Post by Lou Jost »

These seem to share the same structural plan as Morpho scales. Morpho buttefly scales have the same layered ribs, with each layer at a fixed angle to the plane of the scale. In Morphos, both the ribs and the flat regions are responsible for the colors.

Some of the flashiest Morphos have many more layers in the ribs than this Sunset Moth, making the colors more intense and pure. Both Morphos and Sunset Moths have two kinds of scales, the ground scales (dark in the Sunset Moth and most Morphos) and the cover scales. The dark scales absorb non-interfering light and make the colors more pronounced. But some species of Morphos (like Morpho sulkowsyi, my local native Morpho) have reduced cover scales and the color is produced by the ground scales. These butterflies look like semi-transparent mirrors flashing as they fly past, and their color changes dramatically with angle of view. On the other hand my local Sunset Moth relative, Urania leilus, has colors that seem less brilliant.

Smokedaddy
Posts: 1953
Joined: Sat Oct 07, 2006 10:16 am
Location: Bigfork, Montana
Contact:

Post by Smokedaddy »

Outstanding

Robert Berdan
Posts: 319
Joined: Wed Oct 18, 2017 8:58 pm
Location: Calgary
Contact:

Thanks for sharing

Post by Robert Berdan »

Beautiful photographs both the coloured images and the SEM's.
RB

Post Reply Previous topicNext topic